A forum for people interested in discussing Jed McKenna's Work and other philosophical matters
Jed McKenna Weblog
To Anonymous, I am charmed by your suggestion. You should know that I read it in 1976 and it changed my life forever. That is, until 2006 when I departed from Adidam. Best of luck to you,
Thank you for your valuable sharing.
I would like to recommend “The Knee of Listening”, I feel it is a worthwhile read.
You are correct. To a degree. I am not a “Jedist” though. The reason I started this Blog was because I began to notice that people were accepting the Jed argument uncritically and I thought that I had some useful to say about that. If you read some of the pages of this blog you would see that I don’t accept Jed’s perspective in toto. I think in the original iteration of Page 1 Intro I said exactly that – maybe I will go back and add that back to page 1. But it is certainly part of other pages’s critiques.
But….does Jed say go out and ‘do it’ or does he say wake up Now… and…  as an expression of that awakedness, allowing for a spontaneous breakdown of all your seeking, including, as you put it so nicely, our “fighting, battling and scrambling”? Yet then he corrupts that radical no-seeking – no-choosing message by suggesting an autolysis simulation exercise of writing in a journal. This is one of my criticisms of his books that I have written about in this blog.
I’m not sure but I believe you have interpreted Jed in a way that is not really justified, perhaps you are not familiar with Non-Dualist, no-seeking philosophy and have therefore interpreted him according to a different philosophical frame.
And I believe you have misinterpreted my relationship both to the Jed material and the spiritual process in general. I have been trying to make my interpretation clear in the last several replies to you. I don’t think I can make myself any clearer. Sometimes when people have such fundamentally different worldviews, it is better to let the debate drop because we begin to go round in circles. Its just not useful to either party and can get rather tedious, don’t you think?
I accept, Abe, that you perceive my worldview as ‘hilarious’ ridiculous and inconsistent. Why don’t we leave it at that.
I wish you well in all your travels.
You’ve had an experience and you want to sit around and chat about it, that’s fine, I agree with you, you can do whatever makes you happy.
But you’ve taken the name of a book that’s number one message is, ‘don’t sit around talking, go out and find the truth, don’t stop until you do!’ And I’m sure you can see the humour of someone doing that?
It’s like calling your blog ‘Mein Kampf’ and talking about capitalism!
It’s not a difference of opinion, it’s right in front of you, and it’s hilarious.
OK Abe, I think I see why you don’t get what I am saying. I have not said that I don’t know what the experience-nature of Reality-God is… I am saying that like a binary switch, I flash on, then off, then on to ‘it’ again, and again. Further, I have noticed that I do not possess the actual power to hold on to my own connection to my-(our) deeper reality- probably because I (the divine) am mesmerized, or you might say addicted, to the enjoyment of a limited consciousness in the case of my own body-mind, for the time being.
If one is lucky, one may awaken to the Great Truth. Then we usually try to hold on to that experience of Truth. Most of us find that it doesn’t work though – trying to hold on. So some try practices (doing) in order to try to recreate that connection to All That Is. But many of us find that that doing is itself generated from the ego wanting to feel grand once again, and is that action of doing is therefore actually self-defeating, and therefore, relinquished. I don’t feel I am inching closer, as you put it, I know that I Am, but ‘I Am’ has a mind of its own, it obviously wants to experience separation-contraction in limited forms (such as ‘me’) and I respect that!
So the ‘doing’ from many transcendentalist-Advaitic-Buddhist perspectives is NOT recommended. In fact it is experienced to be counter-productive. ‘Waiting’ is just a way of indicating an acceptance of that conundrum. It is not that we “think we are separate,” we know that we are NOT separate. But we find we don’t really have the power to control this manifestation-contraction phenomenon.
If you find your ‘doing’ is good for you then I would completely support you to continue it for as long as you like. I and many others though, having experienced the Truth of our Existence, are taking a different tack. Viva le difference!
I may “sound like Bob” to you but that is no matter to me. I am not trying to convince or proselytize people, and I am happy for you to see me any way you like. This forum is simply for people to share a particular kind of Transcendent experience and have a little chat about it. The work of transformation (either initiated by the self or provided for mysteriously by the Divine) is a private matter ultimately and there is nothing really to debate- you see it your way and I see it mine. I could but don’t want to deconstruct or critique your experience of reality, or at least your representation of it. I wish you great happiness and success with it, whatever it is.
All the Best,
You fail to see how ‘waiting’ is different from ‘doing’……?
While you still think that you are separate then all you can do is look for the truth, search for it…… it’s not going to come and find you!
What are you even surrendering to? You don’t know yet…….
You sound like Bob from the book…… trapped while thinking he’s inching ever closer.
I see what you are referring to Abe and it is true that my own transformation has not been absolute and instantaneous – my bad. But for my ‘waiting’ you substitute – fighting, battling and scrambling, and I fail to see how that is substantially different from the ‘waiting’ that I refer to. It seems at best a different style of waiting and also presumes the efficacy of an active, willful, self-generated action of transformation, and also, I believe, neglects the element -for lack of a better term – of surrender, or understanding that ‘no one can choose enlightenment’, to quote Jed and many others.
I imagine that in actual life, you and I would not really be so far apart in how we have resonated with the great truth of existence, but words tend to make mountains out of molehills.
Thanks for the above, the problem I have is that you include ‘waiting’. If you look inside and truly work back and see what you are, even a glimpse, then that kicks off a process that doesn’t include waiting! It’s a constant battle, constant fight……constant scramble. If you’re path includes ‘waiting’ then maybe that’s what you’ll get?
But I wish you well, good luck with it all,
Thanks for your contribution. To respond to your question, it comes down to ‘walking and chewing gum at the same time’, if you can see what I mean. Most people who participate in this forum would easily confess that they are not ‘vampires’ but involved in the protracted process of adapting the body-mind-ego to the Truth they have experienced. My old teacher had a fine quote about that, he said, ‘the Way begins with the Realization, but the body-mind takes time to adapt to that realization, therefore he offered a ‘practice’. Whether or not you find a ‘practice’ useful or absurd, there is still a lot of time spend ‘waiting-processing-surrendering, or just being the fool that you are- whatever you call it -until the transformation is completed. For more on that paradox perhaps you would find the essay titled “Non-Dualist Fundamentalism” interesting.
Didn’t the books say to “see it for yourself”….”don’t sit around talking about it, putting it off, do it now!”
Could this blog be seen as another attempt to put off “looking for yourself”? I don’t want to be critical but wasn’t that the point of the books?
Has Maya struck again?
Sorry Pete, but this blog is about Jed’s teaching , it is not BY by Jed himself. See the front page of this blog.
Jed have you gone thru the death experience that U.G. talks about?
. . . also, Ramana Maharishi experienced it as a young man. And Nisargadatta
has spoken about it just once.
I’ve written several advaita types and they were kind enough to write back
but they never anwered the question.
I’m not trying to ‘give you shit’ or set you up to later denigrate you. . .
I’m just curious if you’ve had the experience.
I like what you have to say and I’m at the point where I don’t know if ‘this thing’
is an attitude, or a physical mutation; and does it matter! It’s disconcerting!
You made me laugh! I reckon lower wind resistance if 2 bodies are bound together. Now you’ve got me commenting on physics! The End must be near! 😉
I love Jed’s spiritual insight. I just do not understand his scientific explanation of two bodies sky diving and attached together would travel faster toward the ground than one body!
200 MPH and 125MPH are the ranges he states in his book.
I remember Newton saying something about all bodies falling to earth at the same rate no matter what the weight.
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